The other day, I asked a question (or perhaps more of a rant) about being invited on a second date by a B2-type woman.

It feels like 5–10 years ago, you didn’t even have to negotiate the allowance. You could just hand over a set amount afterward. Wasn’t there a golden age like that? lol These days, I imagine you nervously asking about the allowance toward the end of the date—if it’s within your expectations, you’re like, “Thank goodness,” but if it’s high, you put on a disappointed face?

If it’s a B2, then at the first meeting—well, in my case, the first meeting is usually just coffee or a light meal—I’d chat for about ten minutes after sitting down, and once things had loosened up a bit, I’d ask, “Since this is B2, the next time we meet would be an adult relationship (intimate). I’ve set the allowance at 50,000 yen—how does that sound?” If she asks for more or says she’d rather have dinner again next time, I’d decide it’s not going to work, nod along politely, and wrap things up quickly. Cut my losses. If we agree, I’ll ask things like whether she has any activities she doesn’t want to do, or whether she’s met any interesting papas (male supporters) before. At that point, what most girls want to know is whether it’ll end after one meeting, whether I’ll continue seeing them, and if so, how many times a month. I tell them, “Some girls only met me once, while the most frequent arrangement was 15 times a month.” I’ve always found it strange how everyone can fall for a woman they haven’t even slept with. I can’t.

When it comes to letter dates through Patolo or Universe Club, I make sure to discuss the allowance in advance before meeting. I do this because I hope clearing up the complicated stuff beforehand will make the conversation at the first meeting more enjoyable. Another reason I prefer letter dates is that you can negotiate the allowance in advance. If it isn’t a letter date, I bring up the allowance during the date when I feel the timing is right. Context is important, so I usually guide the conversation in that direction myself and bring it up once the moment feels right. On the other hand, I almost never discuss the allowance afterward over LINE or anything like that. > I’ve always wondered how you can like a woman you haven’t even slept with. I could never do that. It’s not that they already like her—they probably want to grow fond of her, right? If you come to like someone through repeated drives and dinner dates, then what comes afterward is amazing. Not that it matters, but today’s blacklisted girl would’ve been really beautiful if she hadn’t talked so much. She just kept going forever—I nearly ended up with ED. B1.

B2 means, “The first meeting is dinner only. From the second meeting onward, it may develop into a relationship.” So I don’t think it would be a problem—or lead to complaints—to ask her directly toward the end of the first date. The issue is that if you bring up that kind of topic (intimacy) right from the beginning or throughout the date, women may complain. It’s better to keep her entertained until the end with normal conversation she’s comfortable with. Then, during the last 10 minutes or so, you can try bringing up the possibility of an adult relationship for the next meeting.

I’m looking for someone to date as part of papa-katsu (compensated dating in Japan), so my main focus is on enjoying the dates. I don’t really feel there’s any need to discuss an allowance upfront. With a B2 type, the focus is on what happens during the first date, so we enjoy the date and, toward the end, naturally end up talking about meeting again. If she places a lot of importance on the allowance, the subject will naturally come up. Otherwise, we won’t discuss an allowance and the conversation will turn to going to a hotel next time. Reading everyone’s answers, I got the impression that many of you have a clear purpose—such as dinner only (no intimacy)—and give straightforward answers. I may try using that as a reference too. At the same time, the fact that there are so many men looking for a transactional relationship made me realize that, conversely, if you properly entertain her and make sure she enjoys the date, your chances of things working out naturally increase. I feel that has both advantages and disadvantages. > “What about just giving her a set amount afterward? Wasn’t there a time when that was considered a good arrangement? lol” I think that’s still a possibility. I feel that women are less likely to be dissatisfied if the allowance is decided after the adult relationship (intimate), since they’ll know what it actually involved. If you decide everything beforehand, depending on how it goes, either the woman may think she should have asked for twice or three times as much—or the opposite. The same can happen with men, so it seems there’s a greater chance of things not matching up than matching perfectly. To Yokandō-san, When I wrote “transactional relationship,” I meant wanting to know the conclusion upfront—having tea first, skipping the date, and finding out immediately what the situation is. In other words, the idea was, “Once I know the answer, I’ll move forward.” Sorry for the confusion m(._.)m > “I’d be scared if she said afterward that her allowance was 15.” You need to be confident that she won’t say something like that after the adult relationship (intimate)…

I’m glad my answer helped you realize that—it made writing it worthwhile. If the woman is a B2, it may come up toward the end of the first meeting, but sometimes it’s brought up when arranging the next date through the thank-you messages after parting ways. It depends on how the conversation flows, but since the nuance matters, I generally think it’s better to discuss it in person.

My main focus is B2. Toward the end of the first meeting, we discuss the terms of the arrangement, such as the meeting time, meeting place, and what we’ll do on the date. Since I don’t drink, if we’re going to spend money on food, I prefer to keep the meal light and use the money for activities or to buy her a souvenir instead. I include those details when I propose the allowance. However, I’m not sure whether she’s truly comfortable with those terms, so when we part, I add, “Please contact me if you’re really okay with those terms.” **Adding this after reading Andy’s answer:** I also have the first meeting at a café. If I feel it’s unlikely to go any further, we part within an hour without exchanging contact information. If we don’t part ways, we change locations and continue discussing the terms while having a light meal or walking around a shopping complex. **Adding this after reading Kamihikōki’s answer:** I’m looking to go on dates, not have a transactional relationship, so women seeking a transactional relationship may find me too much trouble. That’s why, when the woman is looking for a transactional relationship, it’s better for both of us to end the meeting early. **One more addition:** The only time I move forward without deciding the allowance in advance is when I’m able to pay the full amount she requests afterward. It would be scary if she later said, like the person who asked the previous question, “I want an allowance of 150,000 yen.”

Like you, I negotiated the terms after exchanging LINE contact information and getting home. If the terms don’t work for you, don’t dwell on it—move on to the next offer.

In my case, with B2, the first meeting is almost always just an hour over tea before we part ways. I explain my terms during the meeting, and if we agree, we meet a second time. If not, I don’t see them again. Of course, I’m sure some women said yes on the spot just to avoid the awkwardness of turning me down, even though they never intended to meet a second time. There were also plenty of cases where we made plans to meet but things never actually progressed. Hope this helps.