Universe Club is no longer involved after the second meeting, so you’ll have to negotiate directly yourself.
If you have her contact information, try messaging her on LINE: “I feel bad bringing this up, but I’d really appreciate it if you could at least cover my transportation costs.”
I’d like to say this to all papas: please give the woman her transportation allowance the moment you meet her. Lots of older men say things like, “It ruins the mood of the date,” but the woman spends the entire meal wondering, “Am I going to get the transportation money?” She can’t fully focus on enjoying the meal.
The same goes for an adult relationship (intimate). As soon as you enter the room, give her the allowance immediately. Otherwise, even if she opens her legs, she hasn’t opened her heart—and in the end, you’re the one who loses out.
If you’re paying, you should show consideration toward the woman. Honestly, I don’t understand why some men old enough to know better put their own feelings first and the woman second.
I rarely make offers to Type C women, but this is how I handle a first date with one:
1. Give her the transportation allowance within three minutes of meeting.
2. If you decide to have an adult relationship (intimate) after the meal, give her the allowance for it at the restaurant.
3. If she says, “It’s okay, you can give it to me later,” hand over the allowance the moment you enter the room.
*Even when meeting Type A or B1 women, I give them the transportation allowance as soon as we meet. On second dates too, I give them the meal allowance first thing when we meet.*
Just doing the above consistently will dramatically improve how women view you.
Try it—you’ve got nothing to lose. Your mood is irrelevant. Seriously, what are you talking about at your age?
Whether it’s papa-katsu (compensated dating in Japan) or the sex industry, putting the woman first should be standard. Why is it so hard for some people to do something this simple?
Update:
Following Mac-san’s example, I also started handing over cash directly, without putting it in an envelope, quite a while ago. I also usually tell her, “Please count it.” Even if it’s not intentional, it’s possible to accidentally be one bill short.
And I’m going to be doing a short-term live-in arrangement next month too, lol.
It can feel like a hassle, but at the same time, it’s kind of exciting, right?
I think there’s an underlying difference in how male and female members view allowances and transportation expenses. So, especially at the beginning, make sure to communicate and confirm the details carefully.
It may be hard to look at it that way, but if you consider this one of the pleasures of papa-katsu (compensated dating in Japan), it might make things a little less stressful.
After all sorts of twists and turns, my current style from the second meeting onward is ¥50,000, including transportation, for dinner only (no intimacy). I don’t think it’s especially high, but I’d like to think no one has complained.
By the way, I always put the money in an envelope. (I’m a regular customer of Kyukyodo.) The bills are crisp and new. These days, even getting crisp bills comes with a fee, but I exchange them in advance so I don’t get the amount wrong. I’m currently learning how to use a brush pen from Midori-chan, so I write “hush money” on the front. I’m getting fairly good at it.
> I’m still pretty new to the club, so I’m not very familiar with how things work, but should something like this be negotiated in advance?
Most men are gentlemen, so this hardly ever happens. Still, on rare occasions, you may come across someone who thought dates alone were free.
The club should be telling both men and women that after the dinner arrangement, it’s a private matter between the two of you, so you should discuss the allowance together. However, it’s possible the staff simply forgot to mention it.
So, after the first dinner, I recommend discussing everything in advance. That way, what happened this time can be avoided.
Generally speaking, most men pay the same allowance as they did for the first meeting. If you ask him via LINE or another messaging app, he may say that he forgot and will pay you next time.
I can’t tell whether this man did it intentionally or simply forgot, but it’s a good idea to agree in advance on the allowance for dinner-only dates as well.
Incidentally, there are also rare cases where a man won’t pay even after going to a hotel. Some strange men will say they thought there was no charge because you hadn’t discussed an allowance, or that they can’t pay because it would constitute prostitution.
That’s why it’s important to discuss the allowance beforehand.
A man who says he can’t pay because it would constitute prostitution seems malicious to me, so I recommend dealing with him according to the situation.
> I also feel uncomfortable asking him outright for transportation money.
Since you met through a dating club, I think he understands the situation as well.
Rather than bringing it up afterward, you may find it easier to ask in advance, “For a dinner-only date, how much allowance were you thinking of?” This makes it sound as though an allowance is a given—you’re simply asking what amount he had in mind.
If he says he wasn’t planning to provide an allowance, or the amount is lower than you expected, you can say, “I see,” and then add something like, “I already have plans next time, so I’ll check my schedule and get back to you.”
You can end the meeting there and ultimately steer things toward not seeing each other again.
There aren’t many, but I know it can be difficult, so women need to be proactive too.
Since it’s hard to bring this up repeatedly, set the allowance terms when you’re invited to an adult relationship after the initial offer if it’s a C arrangement, or when you’re invited to meet again if it’s a BA arrangement:
How much for an adult relationship, and how much for dinner only with no intimacy.
Decide these in advance. If he doesn’t bring it up, make sure you ask and settle the terms yourself.
When he invites you to meet again, even if it’s just for dinner, message him something like, “How much could you provide for transportation?”
If you simply go along with everything without saying anything, that becomes the default.
That said, in my case, Fuu, I make it clear that there’s no allowance for dinner only.
I do papa-katsu because I want an adult relationship, and I take women to nice restaurants for meals and drinks. There are women in their twenties who are willing to go with me even without being paid, so with women in a monthly arrangement, I sometimes go to lunch with them without giving an allowance.
Be sure to clearly communicate your terms. Even if it ends the relationship, I think it’s better than not asking, having a bad experience, and then ending things—the damage is smaller because at least you knew what to expect.
Good luck—I’m rooting for you.
It’s usually considered bad manners, but if the other person is young or inexperienced, they may think simply treating you to dinner is enough. Rather than worrying about it, I’d recommend asking them directly.
> I’m doing papa-katsu (compensated dating in Japan) because I want an adult relationship (intimate).
It’s interesting that people at the club have such different ways of thinking. I believe that the more varied people’s perspectives are, the better the match between men’s and women’s needs becomes.
When I first joined, I already had no shortage of girlfriends or sex partners, so I had absolutely no interest in papa-katsu. However, a beautiful woman I was dating told me she had joined, so I joined out of curiosity, seeing it as one place to meet wonderful women.
Even now, I still have some of that original mindset. When it comes to allowance for an adult relationship, I only have a vague understanding personally, but within the club’s context, I feel I understand it quite clearly.
From what the beautiful women who joined the club have told me, they often have the strong impression that:
“Men think they can do anything if they have money.”
They drive luxury cars like Porsches and Ferraris, take them out to eat at upscale city-hotel restaurants, bring them on overseas trips, and give them expensive watches and other gifts. You can feel the power and pressure of money, so even when messages keep coming in on LINE right in front of me, they simply ignore them…
There’s no relationship as relaxed and enjoyable as one with a classmate, friend, colleague, or member of the opposite sex when money isn’t involved.
Once money enters the picture, whether you fully accept it as a transactional relationship or take the opposite approach, I think you can maintain either a special relationship or a practical, mutually beneficial one if both sides understand each other.
Based on what the beautiful women who joined the club have said, I think most male members would be wise to understand the example and explanation given by “Makechichi” [a veteran member]. The stronger your presence or pressure, the more important it is to put yourself in the other person’s position—especially if you have an S-type personality.
Even wealthy men should understand that, when they go through a club and use money to ask for a relationship with a woman, they are essentially at the very bottom of the social ladder when it comes to relationships between men and women—almost like a romantic homeless person or someone in desperate circumstances.
Men who don’t do well are often the ones who fail to understand the nature of the relationship and their position in it. After all, once the women are there, men will flock to them whether they like it or not…
As for the question, not giving her anything at all is out of the question. But an even worse situation is a one-sided relationship where she can’t even ask about it. And if this was already the second meeting, then failing to realize that the relationship was still like that at such an important point shows such a lack of consideration that he had no business meeting her again.
I prefer handing over cash without an envelope.
Even one or two 1,000- or 5,000-yen bills can be valuable. Not just for taxi fare, but also for water, gum, the extra fare for riding one station past your stop, and so on…
Rather than spending large bills, I think what makes people around you say, “What a gentleman,” is using money in small, thoughtful ways. The things that make someone happy are often unexpected, unanticipated little gestures and differences like that.
I’m surprised there are people who don’t give the allowance without agreeing on it beforehand. If he didn’t say anything after you parted ways, then it wasn’t simply an oversight.
That’s why you should agree on the allowance before meeting for the second time.
In my case, I present:
- The amount without an adult relationship (intimate)
- The amount with an adult relationship (intimate)
- The amount for a half-day arrangement (which includes both “without” and “with” an adult relationship)
As we meet a few times, we adjust the date details and the allowance.
As for the allowance, I put it in an envelope and hand it over as soon as we meet. I also ask them to count it. I’d only hand it over loose after we’ve become quite close.
When I bring the other person a gift, I think of it the same way as having a shop wrap it for me.
You have to say, “Could I get transportation money?” Men genuinely forget sometimes. The club only looks after the first date (the initial meeting); after that, you’re entirely on your own.
Makeotoko said:
> I hand over the transportation money the moment we meet, and on the second date, I also give her the dinner allowance upfront as soon as we meet.
I do the same. Partly because I want to be considerate of how the woman feels, but honestly, I genuinely forget sometimes.
Every now and then, after I say, “Thanks, see you,” she’ll say, “Um… what about the allowance?” I feel incredibly apologetic and embarrassed.
Also, I hand over the money loose, without putting it in an envelope. Partly because it’s easier for her to check, and partly because, on a purely instinctive level, I think, “Why are you putting 10,000 or 50,000 yen in an envelope like it’s a wedding gift?” But do some women feel more valued when the money comes in an envelope? I’m not planning to change my way, though.
Starting tonight, I’ll be living with a 21-year-old for the first time in a while, for about three weeks. I’m waiting for her to come back now. I’m in a really good mood—it makes me happy.
> I occasionally go out for lunch without receiving an allowance.
Come to think of it, I don’t give money when we just have dinner—or even when she sleeps beside me—unless we have an adult relationship.
The girl sleeping beside me right now, breathing softly while completely naked, is the same. I suppose I am effectively covering the rent by letting her stay here, though. Since I give her 50,000 yen when we have an adult relationship, anything else could also be considered part of the arrangement.
I came up with my own saying: “Women and money are best left uncovered.” I wonder if men who hand over money in envelopes also prefer women in their underwear?
