I’m new to this. When I ask a woman what allowance she’s looking for, she often tells me to decide.

If this was an offer through Universe Club and it’s your first date, their rules require you to give her a token of appreciation called transportation money during the meal. So if you answered “Meal 2,” you first need to give her 2 at the meal. If nothing was specified, then 1 is fine according to the rules. The woman cannot ask for 2 for the first meeting under the rules. So if the man only wants to give 1, doesn’t want to pay a penny more, and is fine with not continuing to see her afterward—in other words, if he absolutely refuses to pay more than 1—then he can simply give her 1 at the meal, in accordance with the rules. After that, if you want to go to a hotel and she agrees to 5, that falls under the private arrangement between the two of you. Failing to give her the agreed-upon 5 would mean breaking your promise. Giving her 1 and saying the remaining amount is 4 is reneging on the agreement, so that isn’t acceptable. In Japan, it seems that people have generally tended to view the act itself as consensual even when the agreed amount wasn’t paid. But now that the legal term has changed from rape to non-consensual sexual intercourse, I think claims that the woman did not consent in such situations may be taken more seriously going forward. There could be arrests and prosecutions, and if the man is someone of social standing, it might even be reported on television. With that in mind, I think that if you agreed on 5, you should properly pay 5 rather than taking it lightly. Also, I’ve been using 5 as the going rate, but if you look at the amounts women are asking for on PATOLO, you’ll notice that fewer women are willing to accept just 5 now, and the amounts have been rising. In that sense, I think the current going rate may be around 8 to 10. Universe seems to have taken the approach of “You two decide; that’s up to you,” in a direction that has backfired. I sometimes wonder whether women in the weaker bargaining position are increasingly agreeing to low amounts. Of course, if the woman isn’t putting up with anything and is satisfied, then I have no complaints. But it does seem that things are heading in a direction where that may not be the case, perhaps because prices have risen and the divide between this and dating apps has grown wider. When you think about it, she has to go through an interview, be asked strange questions—such as how much she wants to make per month or whether she likes sex—and sometimes even be asked by young staff members who don’t seem to know much about papa-katsu (compensated dating in Japan) whether she can go to a hotel with a man. In some cases, she may even be rejected at the interview. After registering under those circumstances and receiving an offer, it seems natural that she would want a reasonable allowance.

Paying 2 upfront for dinner, then adding 3 afterward if you go to a hotel doesn’t really make sense. Most women would think, “Wait, only 3 for an adult relationship?” If it’s 2 for dinner, it would need to be around 7 for an adult relationship to feel balanced. So if you want to keep the total amount down, you should make the terms clear, such as: - “I’m hoping for a total of 6. I’ll pay 1 for dinner, and add 5 if we go to a hotel afterward.” - “From the second date onward, I’ll pay a total of 5 without dinner, or 6 with dinner.” Otherwise, she won’t be able to focus on the date, and even if you get her panties off, she’ll probably be completely dry. If you’re not good at negotiating allowances, I think PATOLO is a good place to practice. I’ve been using PATOLO occasionally lately to practice communicating the allowance. I try to use the word “total” when doing so. The term “transportation expenses” can be confusing for both men and women. So if you’re offering a total of 6, I think it’s best to say, “I’m thinking of 6 in total,” then hand her 1 as soon as you meet. If she agrees to going to a private room, you can say, “As I mentioned beforehand, I’ll give you the remaining 5 of the total 6,” hand her the 5 at the restaurant, and then move on to the hotel. Incidentally, when you read the message from Universe Club after the arrangement is confirmed, it clearly states that transportation expenses and the allowance are separate, doesn’t it? That’s why I understand it to mean that for the first date, you must always give her 1 in transportation expenses separately from the allowance. In other words, you can spend the first two hours having dinner for 1, and the allowance for the adult relationship afterward is separate from the transportation expenses. From the second date onward, there’s no longer any concept of transportation expenses, so something like 5 for an adult relationship with no dinner should be fine. P.S. Looking at PATOLO, I do get the impression that many women are asking for 6 or more as an allowance. Some even ask for over 20, and I’ve also seen women whose requested amount was 10 and thought, “Wait, with that looks?” I wonder if the going rate for allowances—the median, at least—has gradually risen compared with before. Maybe it’s like inflation.

It’s a shame when a woman says “whatever you think is fair,” yet you decide based on the going rate rather than your own values（笑） When a woman says “it’s up to you,” I think it can be a sign that she trusts you, or that she’s saying the value of seeing you is greater to her than the money. Of course, taking that as an excuse to haggle is out of the question. At the same time, if she’s a good woman you want to treat well, you’ll probably see her dozens of times. So how do you think about the ongoing cost? Doesn’t the value of having someone trust you and say that seeing you matters more than the money count for something? Even though she says she’s fine with it (though I always confirm, of course). So in those situations, I offer 4, slightly below the going rate of 5, and continue seeing her for a long time. If you ranked women by the total amount I’ve given them, the top spots would be occupied by women I paid 4 to. Well, everyone has their own way of thinking（笑） Dating clubs want to keep the going rate for allowances high, because that attracts more women. At Universe, terms are negotiated individually, so for women registered with multiple dating clubs who seem likely to receive a decent number of offers, I get the impression that they’re often quoted a higher amount through Universe than through the other clubs they belong to. With PATOLO, it’s easy to tell because the women write down their desired amount. To the male members here, I strongly recommend registering with other clubs as well. You’ll often think, “Oh, I’ve seen this woman before,” and it really gives you something to think about（笑） There’s no such thing as a “market” or “going rate” in dating clubs. In the end, it’s a world where people with limited information get taken advantage of. Well, if you have the financial means to be taken advantage of, then no problem（笑） Anyway, everything up to this point was a message for the male members reading this forum. As for the answer to the original question: - If it’s the first meeting, Universe’s rules require you to give her transportation money, so give the transportation amount (1) separately. - Transportation money is compensation for her coming to the meeting place. Decide for yourself what to give for the meal and any adult relationship afterward. - If your terms are 2 for dinner and 5 for an adult relationship, it’s up to you whether dinner plus an adult relationship means a combined 5 or separate amounts totaling 7. OK牧場. - Since this is something between the two of you, always confirm with the woman, in an atmosphere where she can freely say no, whatever the situation. - Once, after we had initially agreed to leave it up to me, I got carried away after we entered the hotel and used the bathroom. The woman then went in afterward and undoubtedly had an experience that stimulated her sense of smell so intensely it may have changed her outlook on life. She didn’t comment on it, but when I confirmed the amount again before giving her the money, it changed from 4 to 5. - At a first meeting, the most important thing is to keep checking that the woman is comfortable with everything. Go home feeling grateful that you’ve learned the going rate is allowance plus 1 if you poop at a love hotel. That’s all. Taro

For a popular woman, it’s perfectly normal to receive tens of thousands of yen even for dinner only (no intimacy). Even in a dinner-only arrangement, she’ll appreciate it if you cover transportation and makeup expenses. After that, it’s all up for negotiation, so handle it however you like. Some people set detailed prices like a hostess club or adult entertainment service, while others simply name a general amount.

This is just the usual market research, isn’t it? Are women quoting answers from online forums as justification for insisting on an itemized rate when negotiating with men—so much for dinner, and so much for the relationship afterward? As a basic rule, dinner alone comes with an allowance of zero. If dinner plus an adult relationship is 50, then it’s still 50 without dinner.

Depending on the person, some may be okay with 1 for dinner only or 3 for an adult relationship, while others may require 2 or 3 for dinner only or 10 for an adult relationship. You should discuss it with each person you meet and decide together, shouldn’t you? The going rates are only a rough reference, so please take things at a comfortable pace and do your best!

I didn’t realize you were asking about the breakdown of what the questioner offered, haha. If you’re going to act like you know the going rates, you should at least know what’s generally typical. Personally, I wouldn’t pay someone an allowance just to have dinner with me, so dinner only is generally ¥0. If it’s dinner plus a hotel, that’s ¥0 + ¥50,000 = ¥50,000.